Two A/C questions

Radiator, thermostat, water pump, antifreeze, etc.
Post Reply
User avatar

Topic author
GEJ
I plan to be buried in my van
Posts: 1487
Joined: Mon Dec 25, 2006 9:50 pm
Location: Rochester,NY

Two A/C questions

Post by GEJ »

I own a high top 1985 Astro which the primary use is a tow van for my snack foods flea market business.It will tow my smaller vendor trailer and store extra stock in stackable plastic cases.I am putting in a 1996 TBI 350.The current A/C isn't working and was disconnected by the owner before me.

The first question is to update the A/C to 1996 engine what parts to use.

The second question is I would like to install a rear A/C to keep the candies cool that are part of the products I sell.How do the rear A/C's work?.Can I use rear A/C's with a plugged in 110 converter.Am I better off installing a roof top RV A/C?.The van will be painted yellow which should help keep it cool in the summer heat while setting there at a flea market.

Thanks for your input in advance,

Gary
Call me Gary

1985 Astro-"Ole Yellar"
1994 LT Astro
1981 Winnebago-"Baby"
12'dual axle enclosed trailer
The vendor trailer


Lead with my heart & take the hits because of it like a man.
User avatar

peter
ASV Supporter
ASV Supporter
Posts: 1354
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2006 7:41 pm
Location: Montreal, Quebec, Canada
Contact:

Re: Two A/C questions

Post by peter »

The 85 is running on R-12 which uses mineral oil. So unless someone had already retro-fitted the system to work with R-134A, you should consider a drop-in replacement for R-12.

One issue is with the Polyoester oil used with R-134A. It's very unforgiving when it comes to moisture. The oil acts as a sponge, an $80 quart of Polyoester oil is garbage if left open to the atmosphere for as little as 5 minutes.
Poly oil also has no tolerance for mixing with mineral and/or Alkybenzene oils. Alky oils have been used for drop in refrigerant replacements for the last 10-15 yrs.

Simply flushing out the mineral oil in the refrigerant lines/circuit supposedly isn't enuf, though. If running the R-12 compressor/condenser, these won't be up to the task. The OEM compressor output is now under-capacity, because R-134A isn't as efficient as R-12 at the same pressures. Not a huge difference, but many automakers had problems with the 1st changeover year cars which ran R-134A. Customers complained that the a/c systems wouldn't cool sufficiently. Existing stock R-12 compressors had been retro-fitted with polyoester oils and revised seals by the manufacturer, but were short on capacity by about 20% when used with R-134A.

People who had converted their a/c systems using a new & true R-134A compressor with faced with another dilemma, now the original condenser was no longer up to handling the increased capacity of the new R-134A compressors. So that had to be replaced as well. Along with the accumulator (standard practice any time you open an a/c system) and the metering device (now no longer sized properly for R-134A).

A true conversion kit for an R-12 vehicle would probably include a new line-set as well as a condenser, compressor, accumulator, metering devise and mebbe even a flushing liquid to ensure that all the mineral oil has indeed been removed. Having stated all the above, there are many who have prolly done none of/not all of the above and gotten satisfactory results just the same. I'm simply writing of what I've seen/heard/witnessed. Some of this info is straight from Honda's service department as well, one of the biggest dealers in Montreal is our customer and I've had many discussions with service personel about the R-12/R-134A switch.

My advice? Try to find one of many drop-in replacements for R-12. R-414 and/or R-416 are supposedly just as good in capacity, if not better.
"Just keep swimming..."
97' 4wd Safari
ZZ 502 Ramjet
4"L"80E/NP241C
Ford 9"


Kinky is using a feather.
Perverted is using the whole chicken.

"Laws that forbid the carrying of arms... disarm only those who are neither
inclined nor determined to commit crimes".
- Thomas Jefferson
User avatar

Topic author
GEJ
I plan to be buried in my van
Posts: 1487
Joined: Mon Dec 25, 2006 9:50 pm
Location: Rochester,NY

Re: Two A/C questions

Post by GEJ »

Thank you for your post Peter.

Anyone know about the OEM rear A/C's?.My guess is it runs totally on a electric system,but I don't know.
Call me Gary

1985 Astro-"Ole Yellar"
1994 LT Astro
1981 Winnebago-"Baby"
12'dual axle enclosed trailer
The vendor trailer


Lead with my heart & take the hits because of it like a man.
User avatar

Smiliesafari
ASV Supporter
ASV Supporter
Posts: 2667
Joined: Sat Dec 02, 2006 12:34 pm
Location: Orlando, FL

Re: Two A/C questions

Post by Smiliesafari »

The rear AC on my 96 is plumbed from the front compressor. It has an evaporator and fan and the cool air is ducted to the top of the rear of the van. The fan and evaporator are behind a panel in the lower left corner. \:D/
1996 Safari SLX Hotair balloon transport vehicle

rlsllc
I sleep in my van
Posts: 901
Joined: Thu Sep 21, 2006 6:35 pm

Re: Two A/C questions

Post by rlsllc »

The rear one on my van is as stated, plumbed from the front one, but there is a weird thing. The front one is orfice tube, and the rear one is expansion port, so neither one works well without the other. I may have that mixed up somehow, but that is the jist of it. I'm in no way an expert on it.
User avatar

Topic author
GEJ
I plan to be buried in my van
Posts: 1487
Joined: Mon Dec 25, 2006 9:50 pm
Location: Rochester,NY

Re: Two A/C questions

Post by GEJ »

Well it seems the only thing I could do is a RV style roof A/C to keep it cool while parked at a fleamarket.I hate the thought of doing that because I think it would look really bad.The back of it is stripped of all the seats etc.That allows for about 15 to 20 cases(or more) of saleable snack food product that doesn't like hot temps. I was going to put in blue board on the sides inside with something to cover that and have bed liner sprayed from the back of the rear seats to the back with tracks to tie down the cases.I sure do want to be smart about how to keep it cool without destroying the look of the van-but I am not sure how I am going to get that done.The rear A/C was a idea for while I drive down the road,but I need to firgure out something while parked.
Call me Gary

1985 Astro-"Ole Yellar"
1994 LT Astro
1981 Winnebago-"Baby"
12'dual axle enclosed trailer
The vendor trailer


Lead with my heart & take the hits because of it like a man.
User avatar

CaptSquid
I plan to be buried in my van
Posts: 1230
Joined: Sun Sep 10, 2006 4:50 am
Location: Billings, MT, 'MERICA!

Re: Two A/C questions

Post by CaptSquid »

Try a small fridge powered by a 600 watt inverter.
Mike, Billings, MT, 'MERICA!
92 Safari SLE w/Z Motor (sold to a good home)
98 AWD Stro LS
93 Suburban Silverado 4x4

Look for the MISSING Alien in the Right Seat. AL, PHONE HOME!!!

ImageImage
Image
User avatar

Topic author
GEJ
I plan to be buried in my van
Posts: 1487
Joined: Mon Dec 25, 2006 9:50 pm
Location: Rochester,NY

Re: Two A/C questions

Post by GEJ »

CaptSquid wrote:Try a small fridge powered by a 600 watt inverter.
Capt-The van would have most of the rear full with product which isn't heat friendly.
Call me Gary

1985 Astro-"Ole Yellar"
1994 LT Astro
1981 Winnebago-"Baby"
12'dual axle enclosed trailer
The vendor trailer


Lead with my heart & take the hits because of it like a man.

astrozam
I have my van tatooed on my cheeks
Posts: 2770
Joined: Fri Sep 08, 2006 2:57 am
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 2 times

Re: Two A/C questions

Post by astrozam »

How have you dealt with this problem in the past?
User avatar

Topic author
GEJ
I plan to be buried in my van
Posts: 1487
Joined: Mon Dec 25, 2006 9:50 pm
Location: Rochester,NY

Re: Two A/C questions

Post by GEJ »

Maybe Peter our resident heating and cooling guy could come up with a suggestion.

Zam-this a new line for us to start carrying.
Call me Gary

1985 Astro-"Ole Yellar"
1994 LT Astro
1981 Winnebago-"Baby"
12'dual axle enclosed trailer
The vendor trailer


Lead with my heart & take the hits because of it like a man.
User avatar

peter
ASV Supporter
ASV Supporter
Posts: 1354
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2006 7:41 pm
Location: Montreal, Quebec, Canada
Contact:

Re: Two A/C questions

Post by peter »

If you insulate the top & sides from the inside with at least an inch of blue styrofoam and the floor of the rear of that van (spray-on urethane from underneath), I can set you up with an evaporator coil and condensing unit (at cost) that runs on 120v. We could even run the condensing unit thru an inverter for use on a coupla 12v deep-cycle batteries, provided your required box temps are reasonable. The higher the temps, the better. Meaning that the deep cycle batteries would last longer.
Of course being the tight jew that you are, I'm sure you'll find this to be too expensive.... :butthead:

:muhaha: :yawinkle:
"Just keep swimming..."
97' 4wd Safari
ZZ 502 Ramjet
4"L"80E/NP241C
Ford 9"


Kinky is using a feather.
Perverted is using the whole chicken.

"Laws that forbid the carrying of arms... disarm only those who are neither
inclined nor determined to commit crimes".
- Thomas Jefferson
User avatar

Topic author
GEJ
I plan to be buried in my van
Posts: 1487
Joined: Mon Dec 25, 2006 9:50 pm
Location: Rochester,NY

Re: Two A/C questions

Post by GEJ »

peter wrote:If you insulate the top & sides from the inside with at least an inch of blue styrofoam and the floor of the rear of that van (spray-on urethane from underneath), I can set you up with an evaporator coil and condensing unit (at cost) that runs on 120v. We could even run the condensing unit thru an inverter for use on a coupla 12v deep-cycle batteries, provided your required box temps are reasonable. The higher the temps, the better. Meaning that the deep cycle batteries would last longer.
Of course being the tight jew that you are, I'm sure you'll find this to be too expensive.... :butthead:

:muhaha: :yawinkle:
Peter-your the man!!!!!. :prayer: :prayer: :prayer: Send me a pm in terms of the costs.I was hoping you would design a system for me.
Call me Gary

1985 Astro-"Ole Yellar"
1994 LT Astro
1981 Winnebago-"Baby"
12'dual axle enclosed trailer
The vendor trailer


Lead with my heart & take the hits because of it like a man.
Post Reply